DH first thoughts
Jul. 22nd, 2007 04:49 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
selene_13Before I go off to plunge myself into the fandom response, I am writing some thoughts down here, of course, behind a spoiler cut:
I am actually a bit on the fence. Bewildered maybe. A little satisfied at how certain things turned out, and disappointed by others. But I am very happy that this book hasn’t left me in a disillusioned rage like HBP did.
To start, I think JKR managed a pretty good conclusion. There was a lot of exposition at the end (I was waiting for someone to holler “Enough with the monologueing!” during the final duel), but I don’t refute that it needed to be said. I was happy with the Snape explanation and the redemption it brought Slytherin House, even though I had expected it. I wasn’t one of those who thought that Snape was in love with Lily (though everyone should be in love with Lily, so why wouldn’t he be?), so I was surprised by his exposition. It was well-written, and explained him a lot, though.
The deaths were pretty much what I expected (Lupin, one Weasley after all, aurors). I knew the sextet would be safe. However, when Harry went off to find Voldemort to get killed, my heart was in my throat for him. I was sure there was a loophole and he’d survive, but his deathmarch to find Voldemort, using the stone to bring his loved ones near him, was heartfelt. I liked the conclusion, I thought JKR had a good grasp of the action (this will make an awesome movie and the moviemakers must be rubbing their hands in glee), and DD’s expanded characterisation made him humanly fallible and therefore much more real than the unrealistic paragon he's been to now. I loved that Ron, Hermione and Neville all got to end a Horcrux. Nice inclusion of Grindelwald too.
The Deathly Hallows: I was thinking they'd prove to be a deus ex machina (look, it's the miracle wand, hidden in the fortress of fortitude, which is the only hope of defeating evil!), but that turned out all right. They were actually a nice balance in the Voldemort/Horcruxes and Dumbledore/Hallows scale (desire, power, corruption and who can resist it), and in the end didn't prove to be the be-all and end-all. Or, at least, they weren't written to be so to Harry even if they were kinda that.
There were some downsides to the book. The middle part, in the tent in the woods, dragged on, and Hermione was crying an awful lot (thanks, JKR, for anvilling that Harry doesn’t like crying girls and that Ginny doesn’t), and why did they need 7 Harry’s to confuse Death Eaters when they all could have disapparated (which is apparently untraceable) like Mundungus at any second, even from within the no. 4 safety spell boundary? Seems like a waste of life and ears.
Fred dying was sort of a surprise, but not too much. I thought JKR was going for Percy because of his noble turnaround. I wished she's left Percy in the dark, or at least in the middle of the conflict, so we wouldn't have the whole of the Weasley clan squeaky clean and noble. I liked that Percy (used to) proved that not every Weasley is predictable, and that every family has their black sheep. It's so black-and-white with JKR and this family.
And that brings me to the shipping, which I still hate. I am very, very happy that Ginny was invisible for most of this book. She got to do absolutely nothing, and I’m grateful. However, it makes Harry’s love very anti-climactic, like it’s not even important who he based his affection on. That might have been JKR’s intent as she wanted to focus on the Voldemort/Harry confrontation, but I find it not very satisfying when I think of what Harry deserves. I still think that Hermione, without whom he would not be alive, without whom he could not have won, without whom the entire plot would have unravelled, has been written and developed as the perfect partner and complement to Harry. Harry may need Ron’s friendship, but he didn’t need Ron personally to finish the quest. Yet he would have failed without her. The way they were together at that graveyard where his parents lie, that was lovely. Her breaking down over Ron the ass, that was pathetic.
Ron was much nicer to Hermione this book, that is certain, but I still greatly dislike him. He is a quitter and always has been. When the going gets tough, he blames it on the other and abandons them. He did it to Hermione in PoA, to Harry in GoF, and he did it to both of them in this book. He always has an excuse (My rat, My pride, My jealousy, My failing, My hunger, My wearing a cursed object), but neither Harry nor Hermione have ever succumbed to this: It is always Ron and his excuses. Sure, he always comes back… but he leaves first, leaving the other crushed. So, sure, he is a good laugh and a brave friend, but he is loyal to himself first, and that annoys me. Hermione deserves better than Ron. Of course JKR brings him back with saving Harry’s life (how else can she possibly redeem him), but that doesn’t change his 7 book long behaviour in my eyes.
At least H/Hr got one scene with them getting it on. This locket-phantom will probably play hotter than any R/Hr or H/G on screen. While reading Harry’s response to it, I could imagine JKR wielding her anvil quite gleefully, but then, I hadn’t expected any different. She’s just bad at understanding it herself.
We predicted Weasley babies right? I counted five at the end. The OBHWF quartet started producing them in their mid-twenties (younger than I am now). The brilliant Hermione too. Yuck. What’s the rush, really? What’s wrong with living a little first, maybe go to university, have a career, see the world. There’s time enough for all of it. I guess Harry and Ginny needed to start early, after all, they’re still missing a Sirius, a Remus and a Cedric. You’d think Ron and Hermione would have helped share the naming load!
I’ve generally hated epilogues, and this one was just too sugary sweet. I like to leave the story at the true finish of it, and prefer to envision my own future for the characters. The future is always uncertain, and I like it to be no different for the people I’m reading and caring about. I have my own imagination, and I prize it.
Sooo, concluding (cause my mind is blank now), I think JKR wrote a pretty decent climax, but her shipping still sucks. If one ignores the shipping (which can be done) the book was quite good, a lot better than HBP, and pretty exciting action-wise. Thank god Harry wasn’t the dumb ass he was in HBP. I loved him again, and for that I can ignore a lot of what I'd otherwise wrinkle my nose at.
ETA: Harry nearly swallowing the Snitch in his first game... isn't that movie canon?
ETA2: Aren't unforgivable curses, you know, unforgivable.
ETA3: I just realised how many post-epilogue fics are going to appear about Potter: The Next Generation. The horror!
And now, I'm off into the wild. I'll be back.
I am actually a bit on the fence. Bewildered maybe. A little satisfied at how certain things turned out, and disappointed by others. But I am very happy that this book hasn’t left me in a disillusioned rage like HBP did.
To start, I think JKR managed a pretty good conclusion. There was a lot of exposition at the end (I was waiting for someone to holler “Enough with the monologueing!” during the final duel), but I don’t refute that it needed to be said. I was happy with the Snape explanation and the redemption it brought Slytherin House, even though I had expected it. I wasn’t one of those who thought that Snape was in love with Lily (though everyone should be in love with Lily, so why wouldn’t he be?), so I was surprised by his exposition. It was well-written, and explained him a lot, though.
The deaths were pretty much what I expected (Lupin, one Weasley after all, aurors). I knew the sextet would be safe. However, when Harry went off to find Voldemort to get killed, my heart was in my throat for him. I was sure there was a loophole and he’d survive, but his deathmarch to find Voldemort, using the stone to bring his loved ones near him, was heartfelt. I liked the conclusion, I thought JKR had a good grasp of the action (this will make an awesome movie and the moviemakers must be rubbing their hands in glee), and DD’s expanded characterisation made him humanly fallible and therefore much more real than the unrealistic paragon he's been to now. I loved that Ron, Hermione and Neville all got to end a Horcrux. Nice inclusion of Grindelwald too.
The Deathly Hallows: I was thinking they'd prove to be a deus ex machina (look, it's the miracle wand, hidden in the fortress of fortitude, which is the only hope of defeating evil!), but that turned out all right. They were actually a nice balance in the Voldemort/Horcruxes and Dumbledore/Hallows scale (desire, power, corruption and who can resist it), and in the end didn't prove to be the be-all and end-all. Or, at least, they weren't written to be so to Harry even if they were kinda that.
There were some downsides to the book. The middle part, in the tent in the woods, dragged on, and Hermione was crying an awful lot (thanks, JKR, for anvilling that Harry doesn’t like crying girls and that Ginny doesn’t), and why did they need 7 Harry’s to confuse Death Eaters when they all could have disapparated (which is apparently untraceable) like Mundungus at any second, even from within the no. 4 safety spell boundary? Seems like a waste of life and ears.
Fred dying was sort of a surprise, but not too much. I thought JKR was going for Percy because of his noble turnaround. I wished she's left Percy in the dark, or at least in the middle of the conflict, so we wouldn't have the whole of the Weasley clan squeaky clean and noble. I liked that Percy (used to) proved that not every Weasley is predictable, and that every family has their black sheep. It's so black-and-white with JKR and this family.
And that brings me to the shipping, which I still hate. I am very, very happy that Ginny was invisible for most of this book. She got to do absolutely nothing, and I’m grateful. However, it makes Harry’s love very anti-climactic, like it’s not even important who he based his affection on. That might have been JKR’s intent as she wanted to focus on the Voldemort/Harry confrontation, but I find it not very satisfying when I think of what Harry deserves. I still think that Hermione, without whom he would not be alive, without whom he could not have won, without whom the entire plot would have unravelled, has been written and developed as the perfect partner and complement to Harry. Harry may need Ron’s friendship, but he didn’t need Ron personally to finish the quest. Yet he would have failed without her. The way they were together at that graveyard where his parents lie, that was lovely. Her breaking down over Ron the ass, that was pathetic.
Ron was much nicer to Hermione this book, that is certain, but I still greatly dislike him. He is a quitter and always has been. When the going gets tough, he blames it on the other and abandons them. He did it to Hermione in PoA, to Harry in GoF, and he did it to both of them in this book. He always has an excuse (My rat, My pride, My jealousy, My failing, My hunger, My wearing a cursed object), but neither Harry nor Hermione have ever succumbed to this: It is always Ron and his excuses. Sure, he always comes back… but he leaves first, leaving the other crushed. So, sure, he is a good laugh and a brave friend, but he is loyal to himself first, and that annoys me. Hermione deserves better than Ron. Of course JKR brings him back with saving Harry’s life (how else can she possibly redeem him), but that doesn’t change his 7 book long behaviour in my eyes.
At least H/Hr got one scene with them getting it on. This locket-phantom will probably play hotter than any R/Hr or H/G on screen. While reading Harry’s response to it, I could imagine JKR wielding her anvil quite gleefully, but then, I hadn’t expected any different. She’s just bad at understanding it herself.
We predicted Weasley babies right? I counted five at the end. The OBHWF quartet started producing them in their mid-twenties (younger than I am now). The brilliant Hermione too. Yuck. What’s the rush, really? What’s wrong with living a little first, maybe go to university, have a career, see the world. There’s time enough for all of it. I guess Harry and Ginny needed to start early, after all, they’re still missing a Sirius, a Remus and a Cedric. You’d think Ron and Hermione would have helped share the naming load!
I’ve generally hated epilogues, and this one was just too sugary sweet. I like to leave the story at the true finish of it, and prefer to envision my own future for the characters. The future is always uncertain, and I like it to be no different for the people I’m reading and caring about. I have my own imagination, and I prize it.
Sooo, concluding (cause my mind is blank now), I think JKR wrote a pretty decent climax, but her shipping still sucks. If one ignores the shipping (which can be done) the book was quite good, a lot better than HBP, and pretty exciting action-wise. Thank god Harry wasn’t the dumb ass he was in HBP. I loved him again, and for that I can ignore a lot of what I'd otherwise wrinkle my nose at.
ETA: Harry nearly swallowing the Snitch in his first game... isn't that movie canon?
ETA2: Aren't unforgivable curses, you know, unforgivable.
ETA3: I just realised how many post-epilogue fics are going to appear about Potter: The Next Generation. The horror!
And now, I'm off into the wild. I'll be back.
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no subject
Date: 2007-07-23 08:13 am (UTC)I didn't like the Deathly Hallows gimmick. The horcruxes were Voldemort's way of being immortal, and thus the Trio had to find them, fine. But then we have the Hallows pop up as another parallel plot thread. What was to stop Hermione looking up a library book and discovering the existence of Merlin's staff / an Atlantean Orb / et cetera? I can't help but wish JKR had tightened the whole thing up, made a good tight neat *elegant* plot, rather than throwing everything but the kitchen sink into it - Hallows, horcruxes, brand-new wand lore, et cetera.
I also got tired real fast of the pacing/feel of the book, with the Trio bumbling around basically following Harry on his hunches, his instinct. Having Remus/'Romulus' actually comment on such might be viewed by some as cute, but it just grated with me. I'd prefer a hero who *thinks* (can anyone think of a certain distaff member of the Trio?) rather than someone who just bumbles around trusting to luck.
OMG I JUST REALISED - NO FELIX FELICIS THANK GOD!!!
Actually, I think DH is further proof to my assertion that HBP was a BAD BOOK, nothing but largely unnecessary filler. I thought your idea in a comment about bundling part of the DH plot into the HBP movie was *excellent* (and a corollary maybe of my BAD BOOK belief).
There was a lot of exposition at the end
Heh. I would have bet anything that at least THIS book would be the one without any final Dumbledore exposition chapter, given, like, that he was *DEAD*. But *still* he comes back to deliver his monologue!! Some blokes just won't take a hint! :-)
his deathmarch to find Voldemort, using the stone to bring his loved ones near him, was heartfelt.
Wasn't that great? The best part of the book, for me. I found it very moving, choked up a little, when Harry took off, seeking solace from his departed loved ones, walking to his death. He's a hero all right.
DD’s expanded characterisation made him humanly fallible
I was converted into the 'evil/bumbling Dumbledore' fan club after HBP, calling him 'patronising' and 'evasive'. I was cheering loudly the several times in the book when Harry thought exactly the same thing. Chilling, that Dumbledore originally planned for Harry to die (permanently) in the defeat of Voldemort.
Dumbledore's exposition explained a lot, but I'm not sure that his 'plan' was way over-complicated and could have easily failed. Why not tell Harry most things front up? I think Harry himself asked him that, I'll have to double-check that one.
The Deathly Hallows: I was thinking they'd prove to be a deus ex machina (look, it's the miracle wand, hidden in the fortress of fortitude, which is the only hope of defeating evil!), but that turned out all right.
(LOL at the Fortress) No, I'm of your first opinion. The whole 'mastering death' thing never was okay; the story of the three brothers and the three magical items made sense, but then the assertion that 'he who possesses all three will master death' just didn't follow, and was never clearly defined. Not that it mattered in the final outcome, but it muddied things up.
The elevation of Harry's cloak to DH status puzzled/frustrated me. Wasn't it supposed to be an uber!cloak, completely impenetrable? Yet we know Dumbledore and Moody could see through it fine.
I suspect I'm missing things, but all the Elder Wand did in the end was reflect back Voldmort's final AK. Did it do anything else? It *didn't* resurrect Harry, that was due to Voldmort's sharing some of his/Lily's 'blood'.
I think the story would have been much better without the Hallows. And I hated how Dumbledore gave the Trio the oh-so-presciently-convenient gifts so they could work it all out. An artificially contrived plot, is my gut feeling.
Continued ...
no subject
Date: 2007-07-24 05:54 pm (UTC)Oh yeah, there were a lot of moments where I thought: What would Harry do if Hermione (she of the awesome handbag) hadn't gone with him. She brought the tent where they lived in, the portret of Phineas, clothes(!), the security spells, the Polyjuice, and whatever more she did that I can't think of now that would probably have meant the failure of Harry's unlucky non-planning. He left The Burrow with nothing on him.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-25 06:10 am (UTC)I almost cheered out loud when Hermione saved the two boys with her quick reaction and extended planning at the wedding. OUR GIRL RULES!!!!
Of course, the whole DD/Grindelwald thing is so Prof X/Magneto.
LOL! I'm not up-to-date with the X-Men, but I like it!
Hey! I thought you were a DC person!? :-)
That reminds me, how dumb was Harry when they got caught because he said "Voldemort" after Ron explained how important it was not to; that there was a Taboo on the name? Hermione gets tortured because of that!
That's okay, he was thinking of Ginny and her 'hard, blazing look' at the time ... :-(
Those fears he had that the locket reflected, it wasn't something he had to overcome: It is handed to him. Harry assures him there is nothing to worry about. Ron will get what he wants, not what he deserves.
Excellent analysis there, good stuff, thanks! You've got me thinking! Imagine if Harry had said 'yeah, mate, I like Hermione too!'. Ron would have chucked a fit and gone home (again).
No, she's been waiting for him all along, ever since PS apparently, so as soon as he wants her, he basically gets her.
That's the bit I hate most of all, yes. According to the anvils Hermione settled on Ron (who knows why) way back, and was just waiting for him to grow up and meet her criteria. "Did I just hear him express concern for house elves?" *ticks box* "Hey, that's the last one; he's good enough for me now!" *smooch*
There is not a single reason why Harry shouldn't look at Hermione romantically at some time, just as there is no reason why Hermione wouldn't at some point consider Harry. Ron and Hermione manage it, why not Harry and Hermione? Even after all the jealousy of Krum and Cho, Harry never once stops to think about what it means or what Hermione means to him, even to decide against it. It just doesn't make any sense for them not to, which is why JKR's surprise about H/Hr is so lame. They should at least consider it as it would be perfectly natural for teenagers to do, but the fact that they don't is ONLY because JKR has decided that they don't because she's made up her mind about R/Hr. Which is why the "she is like a sister" is an anvil from the author, not something we ever see Harry reason through or decide on his own by considering what it would be like to be with Hermione as opposed to Cho or Ginny or even Fleur.
Word.
I've even read numerous H/G stories where, somewhere in the beginning, Harry considers Hermione as a potential girlfriend (even one where he kisses her). You're so right; JKR had all the sensitivity, subtlety and sophistication of a
sledgehammeranvil in blocking off H/Hr. Let *Harry* tell us why he sees her as only a sister!Oh well. Let the new fan fiction commence!
no subject
Date: 2007-07-24 06:09 pm (UTC)I was converted into the 'evil/bumbling Dumbledore' fan club after HBP, calling him 'patronising' and 'evasive'.
Me too. I thought exactly those things, and just plain illogic for DD not to tell Harry anything, not to mention extremely irresponsible with children (the whole "good job, idiot" thing). But, now that we know he was once a young boy who made many mistakes, who walked the grey line, who was tempted by power and is fallible, I like DD much more. That's a feat in this one last book. Of course, the whole DD/Grindelwald thing is so Prof X/Magneto. :)
'he who possesses all three will master death' just didn't follow, and was never clearly defined.
Yes. Besides killing Voldemort with the wonder-wand, what exactly was the effect of all three objects being in the possession of a single person?
I wish JKR had introduced the idea of Hallows before, even just a mention of the fable. Then it wouldn't seem so much as something she just pulled out of a hat (JKR was all like "La, nobody's figured out the ending", when honestly, how is one to make up Hallows? Everybody predicted that Harry might die and come back a la Jesus/Gandalf, that the Horcruxes would be hunted and that Snape was good.
And I hated how Dumbledore gave the Trio the oh-so-presciently-convenient gifts so they could work it all out. An artificially contrived plot, is my gut feeling.
True, but then, there is always this sort of mystery that would be much more easily solved if people'd just talk to one another, but JKR has surely done this before (the Triwizard Cup when Crouch!Moody could have easily portkeyed Harry's toothbrush; the teacher's defences in PS which were catered specifically to the talents of Harry&friends; refusing to tell Harry about his psychic link with Voldemort in OotP, which would ease his mind about why he can't know the plans and why he dreams what he does).